tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post114424972661444369..comments2023-11-16T03:47:04.958-06:00Comments on Midnight Cafe Discussions: Judas: the book tourMat Brewsterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10572618956112125321noreply@blogger.comBlogger62125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144950688116019352006-04-13T11:51:00.000-06:002006-04-13T11:51:00.000-06:00Very intersting...Sounds like Miss Tacos (er, what...Very intersting...<BR/><BR/>Sounds like Miss Tacos (er, whatever her name is) stands to get rich here...<BR/><BR/>Typical...bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144950176585778882006-04-13T11:42:00.000-06:002006-04-13T11:42:00.000-06:00Update on this story....<A HREF="http://www.nytimes.com/2006/04/13/science/13judas.html?ei=5065&en=7e8f2d9b53f573f7&ex=1145592000&partner=MYWAY&pagewanted=print" REL="nofollow">Update on this story....</A>JShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03837745315360109036noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144938065730073922006-04-13T08:21:00.000-06:002006-04-13T08:21:00.000-06:00Just wanted to mention that my Dad asked me to spe...Just wanted to mention that my Dad asked me to speak where he preaches this Sunday night.<BR/><BR/>I wrote a sermon titled "The Bad News of Judas". It brings up the news about "The 'Gospel' of Judas" briefly and then shows how Judas fell into sin. <BR/><BR/>The story of Judas is really a cautionary tale. We can fall into sin and "crucify Christ anew" too.<BR/><BR/>Anyway, just thought I'd mention it. This discussion fueled a great deal of what went into the sermon.bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144866111111257522006-04-12T12:21:00.000-06:002006-04-12T12:21:00.000-06:00Choosing faith is like setting up for a hot and he...Choosing faith is like setting up for a hot and heavy debate.<BR/><BR/>First there are ground rules no name calling and no getting personal so on and so on.<BR/><BR/>If you’re going to begin a walk of faith that has a defining document you must first decide if that document is true.<BR/><BR/>There are a lot of folks who have decided that collection of manuscripts is the real deal and have read them as such without asking whether or not it’s true. If think some people don’t because they can’t face the idea that something they have done for so long could not be as secure as they think it is.<BR/><BR/>What a horrible shame that is!!! If they could spend a bit of time digging they would realize that the book we call the Bible to day is just as sound, if not more so, than it was in the time of the apostles. Not only that but it’s got more supporting information in other texts from that time then ever before and the understanding of Biblical texts is so much more advanced that it was even a century ago.<BR/><BR/>The core question of ones faith being built on “solid rock” is one that might shake the foundations but will ultimately establish their house of faith on a more secure platform than they started with.mullinz8https://www.blogger.com/profile/18281212571618971818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144845491535683182006-04-12T06:38:00.000-06:002006-04-12T06:38:00.000-06:00Good. I was begining to think I was retarded and ...Good. I was begining to think I was retarded and couldn't get a simple point across if it killed me.<BR/><BR/>And the whole "safe not saved" phrase is something I've heard a million times and assumed everyone else knew what I meant.<BR/><BR/>The majority of the world does believe in something "bigger." Sadly I think a lot of folks never actually try to figure out what that is.Mat Brewsterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10572618956112125321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144845161782579002006-04-12T06:32:00.000-06:002006-04-12T06:32:00.000-06:00I see what you mean, Brew...I like your point, too...I see what you mean, Brew...<BR/><BR/>I like your point, too, Jamison. People know there's something "more". They want to know what it is. Sometimes it takes that extra slap upside the head for them to look for it.bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144806867137402412006-04-11T19:54:00.000-06:002006-04-11T19:54:00.000-06:00Keeping it going with the "bigger something out th...Keeping it going with the "bigger something out there" thought...<BR/><BR/>After 9-11, Dalraida (and most other churches I am assuming) had a HUGE surge in attendance. It wasn't just the old members who decided now would probably be a good time to start going back to church, but strangers. People who may have never been in a church.<BR/><BR/>about 3 or 4 months after that, our numbers settled back down.<BR/><BR/>It seems the majority of people fear hell in some way and desire heaven (Whatever their interpretation of each is). They feel in their hearts that this isn't all and that they could, in fact, die one day without notice. Sad it took something like that, but it reaffirms the "something bigger out there" theory that most people have.JShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03837745315360109036noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144798323829818102006-04-11T17:32:00.000-06:002006-04-11T17:32:00.000-06:00It's ludicrous to say that the innocent are not sa...<I>It's ludicrous to say that the innocent are not saved.</I><BR/><BR/>What are they saved from? Hell? They are innocent, thus they have nothing to be condemned for. <BR/><BR/>I have sinned, therefore I am condemned, but the blood of Jesus saves me. A child is innocent and is judged as such so Jesus need not save them. That's why I say they are safe. They are heaven bound, but not in the same manner as us.<BR/><BR/><I>From what I understood, Brew's original point seemed to be that you can't go on the Bible alone for your faith.</I><BR/><BR/>Nope, not what I'm saying at all. But the begining of faith isn't some finer point of biblical doctrine.<BR/><BR/>The first question of faith is more like "is there a god?" This progresses to "is the bible true?" <BR/><BR/>The bible absolutely can be the sole foundation of faith. But first you have to decide if the Bible is the word of God. <BR/><BR/><I>They probably beleive in God because their parents did. Now, make no effort to know God more...</I><BR/><BR/>This is exactly what I'm talking about. To accept the status quo without every questioning that belief isn't really faith. <BR/><BR/>Biblical faith isn't going to church because momma said so. God doesn't ask for pew fillers, or mindless automatons who believe in baptism because that's what their family has always believed.<BR/><BR/>Faith comes from searching. Faith comes from hearing the word of god. That's not hearing it as background noise. That's actively hearing and studying the Word. <BR/><BR/>That's all I'm talking about. Biblical faith takes some effort.Mat Brewsterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10572618956112125321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144783906769029152006-04-11T13:31:00.000-06:002006-04-11T13:31:00.000-06:00OK, another comment about Judas I found interestin...OK, another comment about Judas I found interesting:<BR/><BR/>John 12: 3-8<BR/><BR/>Mary, therefore, took a pound of ointment of pure nard, very precious, and anointed the feet of Jesus, and wiped his feet with her hair. The house was filled with the fragrance of the ointment. Then Judas Iscariot, Simon's son, one of his disciples, who would betray him, said, "Why wasn't this ointment sold for three hundred denarii, and given to the poor?" Now he said this, not because he cared for the poor, but because he was a thief, and having the money box, used to steal what was put into it. But Jesus said, "Leave her alone. She has kept this for the day of my burial. For you always have the poor with you, but you don't always have me." <BR/><BR/>Judas apparently had money motivation long before he accepted silver for Jesus' betrayal. Interesting insight into his character...bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144780321278975982006-04-11T12:32:00.000-06:002006-04-11T12:32:00.000-06:00I have felt the "bigger" something out there, too....I have felt the "bigger" something out there, too. But, I feel like it's something less tangible.<BR/><BR/>I certainly don't think it's extra-terrestrials since I absolutely don't believe they exist.<BR/><BR/>The "bigger" thing to me is a sort of social change I see coming. I just feel like people are smart and they will, at any moment, have this awakening. They'll realize that their spiritual selves need renewing and they'l be looking for some way to do that.<BR/><BR/>We have to be ready for that, my friends.<BR/><BR/>The other "big" thing I thing about is how we're surrounded all the time by God and His Angels.<BR/><BR/>It's a beautiful thing to never be alone. <BR/><BR/>While my faith rides on "evidence" and "substance", it also rides on my recognition of God's presence in my life. My walk with Him and Jesus and the Spirit confirms my desire to build up my faith and the faith of others.<BR/><BR/>Perhaps that's the biggest thing of all!bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144779390730445992006-04-11T12:16:00.000-06:002006-04-11T12:16:00.000-06:00I believe that many people go to church on inertia...I believe that many people go to church on inertia rather than faith. They have gone for years and have been taught that’s where they are supposed to be on at least Sunday morning. Not going is somehow wrong. Yeah yeah scripture BCV, BCV. Their faith is inactive and flaccid.<BR/><BR/>That faith is stupid and pointless. People need to have their faith picked on in order to grow. Too many people are not in a situation, which we enjoy, to have someone call an aspect of faith stupid and then explain why.<BR/><BR/>I’m very envious of preachers because it’s their job to study and reaffirm their faith to guide others to be in a like place. It’s a difficult job though.<BR/><BR/>We do have a unique situation, not that we should pat each other on the back, where we can call into question an aspect of someone’s beliefs and make them stand their ground.<BR/><BR/>For an answer to Brews question, I don’t think it was entirely rhetorical. It’s the facts that underpin my faith. I would rather consider Buddhism because it’s much more peaceful and takes up very little time and the consequences are a bit less harsh at the end of your many spins into nirvana. <BR/><BR/>As I mentioned I have a feeling that something “bigger” is out there waiting for us, it could be Jamison’s UFO, I don’t know, but “something” is out there and inside of here (me). The display of faith in a small number of folks before I was a member of the church was awesome and powerful. Once I learned a few of the ropes it felt very natural. Now the physical evidence of Christ’s life is what has cemented me into this faith over anything else. I didn’t ride in with an introduction from my parent’s faith, I found it myself and today I nurture that experience with study. When I was at FU I didn’t feel religious, it was an exercise but not a full emersion into why I believe and why I have faith. <BR/><BR/>As a Christian I feel very young because it’s been in the past five years, two specifically, that I feel I’ve really TRIED to wear the mantel of active student in Gods world rather than character in Gods play. <BR/><BR/>The leap of faith is what started me on the road and the signs along the way are what have kept me here.mullinz8https://www.blogger.com/profile/18281212571618971818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144772172286901362006-04-11T10:16:00.000-06:002006-04-11T10:16:00.000-06:00Great idea!We should get a prime piece of real est...Great idea!<BR/><BR/>We should get a prime piece of real estate out in rural Heaven and build some nice houses overlooking our own lake/ocean...<BR/><BR/>We can fish and talk about how cool it is to fly and breathe underwater...bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144767924526046412006-04-11T09:05:00.000-06:002006-04-11T09:05:00.000-06:00I have no doubt there are levels... my level will ...I have no doubt there are levels... my level will be pretty low, but I am willing to take the lowest level of Heaven than the coldest part of Hell... maybe we can all pool our good deeds and get a nice big place in heaven and live together!JShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03837745315360109036noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144764614679097842006-04-11T08:10:00.000-06:002006-04-11T08:10:00.000-06:00This does open a new discussion about "levels" of ...This does open a new discussion about "levels" of Heaven...<BR/><BR/>Perhaps a new blog on it would be cool to discuss?<BR/><BR/>Consider Rev 22:12 Behold, I come quickly. My reward is with me, to repay to each man according to his work.<BR/><BR/><BR/>Also, 1 Cor 3:8 Now he who plants and he who waters are the same, but each will receive his own reward according to his own labor.<BR/><BR/>Kind of interesting...bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144763971238196272006-04-11T07:59:00.000-06:002006-04-11T07:59:00.000-06:00im doing the ctrl c thing now too...Yeah, id say r...im doing the ctrl c thing now too...<BR/><BR/>Yeah, id say retarded people are not only safe, but they are saved. So are aborted babies and the like... I mean, if they aren't saved, is there a "special" heaven like the special olympics for them? Mansions with bars down the halls and bars around the toilets and the ovens controls are set lower and the light switches are lower to accomodate people in wheelchairs?JShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03837745315360109036noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144763658862071332006-04-11T07:54:00.000-06:002006-04-11T07:54:00.000-06:00BTW, Jamison, I always do a "Ctrl + C" for my post...BTW, Jamison, I always do a "Ctrl + C" for my posts before I try to submit on here. Then, if word verification screws you, you have a back up...bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144763575040448642006-04-11T07:52:00.000-06:002006-04-11T07:52:00.000-06:00That, I can accept...I just don't agree with the i...That, I can accept...<BR/><BR/>I just don't agree with the idea that "simple" faith exhibited by children and simple-minded people, based on their love for God and simple understanding of the Word is invalid.<BR/><BR/>I got the idea about children and the "child-like" not being saved from Brew's comment <BR/><BR/>"They are safe, not saved."<BR/><BR/>I simply don't agree based on Matt 18:3...<BR/><BR/>But, really, back to the main point. I agree that those who make no effort to know God and walk with Jesus don't really have a true faith. <BR/><BR/>Again, Romans 10: 17 So faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. <BR/><BR/>And still, those little children and mentally disabled people who learn the Word in their own way and develop a faith through their unfettered love for Christ are far from unfaithful.<BR/><BR/>Still, "stupid" is an accurate term for people who have the smarts and don't ask, seek, and knock. With that, I'll agree...bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144760576703895452006-04-11T07:02:00.000-06:002006-04-11T07:02:00.000-06:00I hate word verification... lost my last post due ...I hate word verification... lost my last post due to it, I'll try again....<BR/><BR/>"It's ludicrous to say that the innocent are not saved."<BR/><BR/>I am almost 99% sure neither said this nor implied it (But I may not have been reading close enough).<BR/><BR/>This is a good discussion, but I am sort of understanding Brew's point. Yet, I dont know ANYONE who beleives in God for NO reason. By your logic, if someone says "I beleive in God because the Bible tells me so." then they aren't 'stupid'.<BR/><BR/>This just came to me... We live in a christian nation... 80 - 90% of Americans say they beleive in God. When asked if they read the Bible or go to church, most say no... THAT is where faith in God is just plain dumb. They probably beleive in God because their parents did. Now, make no effort to know God more...<BR/><BR/>Brew, is this what you are trying to say? I seriously doubt there is anyone we know that beleives in God for no reason at all...JShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03837745315360109036noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144758616261867762006-04-11T06:30:00.000-06:002006-04-11T06:30:00.000-06:00"Children and people with an intellect of a child ..."Children and people with an intellect of a child don't really count for this discussion."<BR/><BR/>Being like a child is one of those things that gets you into the "Kingdom of God" or the church.<BR/><BR/>Consider Matt 18:3 and said, "Most certainly I tell you, unless you turn, and become as little children, you will in no way enter into the Kingdom of Heaven. <BR/><BR/>It's ludicrous to say that the innocent are not saved.<BR/><BR/>On top of that, if one with the intellect of a child becomes a Christian and continues in his juvenile faith, he's still saved.<BR/><BR/>From what I understood, Brew's original point seemed to be that you can't go on the Bible alone for your faith. However, I used the "faith by hearing the Word" verse to dispute this.<BR/><BR/>Children hear the word, mentally disabled people hear the Word and both understand what they can and generally accept it as long as they have some motivation to do so.<BR/><BR/>In any case, my point is still that faith and the depth thereof is NOT dependent on intellect.bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144723940834510802006-04-10T20:52:00.000-06:002006-04-10T20:52:00.000-06:00Oh, let me define my term since everybody is offen...Oh, let me define my term since everybody is offended by "stupid."<BR/><BR/>We're talking about the meaning of life here. We're talking about what happens after this life.<BR/><BR/>If we are right, then after we die we spend eternity, forever, in heaven.<BR/><BR/>But what if we're wrong? Then there is what? nothing, a void? or hell? What if there is an afterlife, but we've got the details wrong and we're going to burn in hell forever because of it.<BR/><BR/>Aren't these things serious enough to give some thought to? To blindly accept anything when you're talking about eternity is the very epitome of stupid. <BR/><BR/>If a stranger knocks on your door, holds out a nondescript key and tell you it belongs to a brand new Mercedes. Then tells you that for $100 he'll sell it and the car to you. Now if you gave that man the money straight up having never seen the car, or any papers signifying that man had a legal right to sell it to you there isn't a person here that wouldn't call you stupid. <BR/><BR/>Why then can I not call someone who takes no more care for his eternal soul anything less than stupid?Mat Brewsterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10572618956112125321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144720361389797762006-04-10T19:52:00.000-06:002006-04-10T19:52:00.000-06:00Boys, I either didn't communicate effectively, or ...Boys, I either didn't communicate effectively, or you're missing my point.<BR/><BR/>I'm not saying you have to get a PhD in christian evidence to have faith. I'm not saying you have to write a 300 page dissertation on the physical implications of the resurection to have faith.<BR/><BR/>I am saying you have to give it some thought.<BR/><BR/>To say you believe in God and have no idea why is <I>stupid</I>.<BR/><BR/>To go to a church and accept all that they teach without question is <I>stupid</I>.<BR/><BR/>I'll ask again, why do you believe in God? Any reason you give means you have thought about it, which means your faith is not blind.<BR/><BR/>Sip quoted the scripture that says faith comes from the hearing the word. That's study, that's intellect.<BR/><BR/>Certainly faith has a mystery to it, it is believe in things unseen or that can't be understood, but if we aren't seeking some understanding, what are we?<BR/><BR/>Children and people with an intellect of a child don't really count for this discussion.<BR/><BR/>They are safe, not saved.Mat Brewsterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10572618956112125321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144699508155696912006-04-10T14:05:00.000-06:002006-04-10T14:05:00.000-06:00I see what you mean...miscom, sorry...I think so m...I see what you mean...miscom, sorry...<BR/><BR/>I think so many times in the church, we miss the point that (pardon the old cliche) it's not what you know it's who you know.<BR/><BR/>We can know the Bible, all the scientific facts to support it, and everything else a Ph. D. could possibly understand and still not know Christ.<BR/><BR/>Just look at recent events with AP and Winkler...<BR/><BR/>Something I've been trying to teach my 6th grade class at church is that you need to know Jesus and try to be like Him.<BR/><BR/>For these kids about to enter Jr. High, everything up until now has been memory work and rote recitation. More than anything they need to understand the concepts of what it is to BE a Christian and KNOW Jesus. <BR/><BR/>These are very abstract ideas, but also so simple.<BR/><BR/>I think about very small children and how we teach them to "love God" and "love Jesus". And, they do! They just love God and it's simple and beautiful and amazing.<BR/><BR/>But, something happens later. Kids start to love other things and that removes their focus on God. Keeping that love and walk fresh is what it's all about for them, us, and everyone else.bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144698721433914902006-04-10T13:52:00.000-06:002006-04-10T13:52:00.000-06:00My point wasn’t that one was a prerequisite or “de...My point wasn’t that one was a prerequisite or “dependant” on the other is was to say that they were “different.” You need faith to have salvation but they are not the same things. <BR/><BR/>All of our faiths and walks are different and they are grown and nurtured by our life experiences and study of the scripture.<BR/><BR/>Our salvation is an extension of our faith but understanding there is no set sliding scale of how much faith determines ones salvations I’m saying that how ones gains their faith is different and subjective to that person alone. <BR/><BR/>I believe that I am saved and you believe that you are saved and in that God knows our hearts but there are those folks who have cried out “Lord Lord” who he will not recognize. I would think that those are folks who, while on earth, thought they were saved too.mullinz8https://www.blogger.com/profile/18281212571618971818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144698665327627092006-04-10T13:51:00.000-06:002006-04-10T13:51:00.000-06:00Interesting note:I got curious about what the name...Interesting note:<BR/><BR/>I got curious about what the name "Judas" means. <BR/><BR/>I thought, "Certainly no one would name their child Judas."<BR/><BR/>Come to find out "Judas" is simply the Greek spelling of "Judah". <BR/><BR/>Of course, Judah was the tribe of Jesus' lineage through David.<BR/><BR/>Just thought that was odd, yet interestingly uninteresting...bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13746420.post-1144696711559991702006-04-10T13:18:00.000-06:002006-04-10T13:18:00.000-06:00Here's another verse supporting the "faith by the ...Here's another verse supporting the "faith by the Word" principle:<BR/><BR/>Romans 10: 17 So faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.bigsiphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13435879973761006243noreply@blogger.com